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Post by michele5611 on Nov 16, 2010 11:46:53 GMT -5
LOL!! I am not sure if I fully reigned you in yet....time will tell...I look forward to the day when I don't have to call you quick draw!
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Post by catstina on Nov 16, 2010 11:56:52 GMT -5
All this tethering talk makes me wonder, is RPB anti tethering? I certainly am, and would think that RPB is as well. Just wondering!
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Post by RealPitBull on Nov 16, 2010 12:03:15 GMT -5
100% anti tethering.
We want to help the breed, we do not want dogs singled out based on breed, yet no one seems willing to concede some things; like how about some laws that are non-breed specific yet address real issues? Issues that, if addressed, could take some of the heat off the BREED? IMO anti-tethering laws would be a big step towards eliminating the perceived "need" for BSL (since tethered dogs are one of the most risky in terms of public safety) as well as helping to put a dent in dog fighting (since dog fighters do not kennel their dogs, but keep them on chains).
Something's gotta give.
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Post by catstina on Nov 16, 2010 12:08:06 GMT -5
Very well said, Mary, I totally agree!
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Post by pitsnpoodles on Dec 2, 2010 22:30:53 GMT -5
HI! I am the VP of Pitbullshirt.com. My husband, Tommy, and I, are the owners of the company. At first I was offended by the post on that other forum...."boycotting us" (pretty funny), but then, I read that they think DDB wants dogs to "run free" ....and I just burst out laughing and felt much better pretty quickly  |
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Post by pitsnpoodles on Dec 2, 2010 22:35:46 GMT -5
I admit, I don't like all of their t-shirt designs (IMO, some of them send the wrong message) HI, I read some of your other posts as well...but how does a skull send a wrong message though? Please explain. I am very open minded... |
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Post by RealPitBull on Dec 3, 2010 8:16:46 GMT -5
HI! I am the VP of Pitbullshirt.com. My husband, Tommy, and I, are the owners of the company. At first I was offended by the post on that other forum...."boycotting us" (pretty funny), but then, I read that they think DDB wants dogs to "run free" ....and I just burst out laughing and felt much better pretty quickly Heehee!! I laughed too. Then I went  Yeah, there is a lot of hyperbole in animal advocacy circles. Some people are just so anxious to promote their own message that they WAY overstate or outright lie about things in order to promote their ideals. Actually I see this happening more and more in Pit Bull circles, but it happens really anywhere, anytime there are debates raging about, well, anything. Also, remember, chaining is an embedded part of oldschool Pit Bull "culture" - a LOT of people, even so-called "responsible" people keep lots of dogs chained in their yard. By default many Pit Bull people are pro-chaining. |
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Post by RealPitBull on Dec 3, 2010 8:20:12 GMT -5
I admit, I don't like all of their t-shirt designs (IMO, some of them send the wrong message) HI, I read some of your other posts as well...but how does a skull send a wrong message though? Please explain. I am very open minded... I state for the record that I love ALL your designs and have no problem with them and I love skulls/skeletons. ;D  |
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Post by catstina on Dec 3, 2010 9:12:11 GMT -5
I wouldn't say I'm a cuddly cutsey type person, but I think that skulls send the tough guy, guard dog image and I don't necessarily think that Pits need to be associated with that image any more than they already are. As I said before, though, that is just my opinion, and that is why they make chocolate and vanilla (or in this case skulls and cute things).
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Post by RealPitBull on Dec 3, 2010 9:46:38 GMT -5
This is an interesting discussion. Someone said to me recently that they don't like tattooed people using their image to promote Pit Bulls (we were talking about an org that combines heavily tattooed people with Pit Bull advocacy work). As long as the dogs themselves are portrayed CORRECTLY, IMO that's all that matters. For instance, I don't like designs that show Pit Bulls lunging at the end of a chain, teeth bared. THAT shows the dogs themselves in a bad light. People that parade around with their dogs on heavy chains and in huge spiked collars send a bad message. But a group of people (i.e. tattooed people or bikers or dancers or small business owners or ANY group) who use their OWN image as a marketing angle to bring positive awareness to Pit Bull issues is another thing entirely. Personally, I find all the overly-cutesy stuff and organizations whose entire mission it is to soften up the image of the breed and portray them as some kind of oversize stuffed toy to be detrimental. Hope I'm making sense. |
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Post by adoptapitbull on Dec 3, 2010 10:00:53 GMT -5
My opinion falls kind of in the middle of Mary and Michele. I wouldn't personally wear a skull t-shirt, and I wouldn't wear a rainbows and butterflies shirt either. It's not that they're bad, just on the "extreme" end in my book. I'm more apt to wear a generic "My son is a Pit Bull" type shirt just because that's more me. Now, if I saw a guy with a skull Pit shirt who had his dog on a chain with a spiked collar, I'd not appreciate it. If I saw a guy with a skull shirt and his Pit on an appropriate lead and collar, I'd be fine with it. I think it's all in the way you present it. That's not to say that a person wearing a white T-shirt is automatically a good owner or the rainbows and butterflies is either, as idiots come in all shapes, sizes, and styles. I can see, though, how some people might be put off seeing a Pit face near a skull. They might associate Pits with death or the grim reaper or some crap. Then again, those are obviously closed minded people. So, yeah, guess my ideas are kind of all over the place. The end point is, everything in moderation |
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Post by michele5611 on Dec 3, 2010 10:30:38 GMT -5
Good post Alison! And for the record I purchased two shirts from pitbullshirt.com and love them both!
Also just to clairfy I was just kidding when I said I prefer all things like rainbows over skulls....I actually fall in the middle myself!
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Post by pitsnpoodles on Dec 3, 2010 21:36:05 GMT -5
I wouldn't say I'm a cuddly cutsey type person, but I think that skulls send the tough guy, guard dog image and I don't necessarily think that Pits need to be associated with that image any more than they already are. As I said before, though, that is just my opinion, and that is why they make chocolate and vanilla (or in this case skulls and cute things). Thanks for responding! ;D Hmmm, just stating my opinion on that .. and certainly not discrediting yours in any way, but your idea of "skulls sending a tough guy/guard dog" thing just seems to really be judging a book by its cover...and that is EXACTLY what I see happening with pitbulls each and every day, and what we are so strongly trying to fight against. Tommy and I set up a booth at a Harley Davidson event, and you can imagine the "tough guys" running rampant there...skulls galore. But I have NEVER had as many people come up to me (all bikers, of course) and tell me about their RESCUED PITBULLS at ANY OTHER EVENT...EVER. And we do lots of events. Thoughts? |
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Post by pitsnpoodles on Dec 3, 2010 21:37:30 GMT -5
Good post Alison! And for the record I purchased two shirts from pitbullshirt.com and love them both! Also just to clairfy I was just kidding when I said I prefer all things like rainbows over skulls....I actually fall in the middle myself! Aww...thank you so much! I am so glad you love them! ;D ;D ;D |
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Post by pitsnpoodles on Dec 3, 2010 21:51:41 GMT -5
I love this discussion...and I love that everyone is so free to post their opinions and feel comfortable doing so. Says a lot about the character of members here I have met INCREDIBLE pitbull moms and dads on both ends of the spectrum.....those who have their pittie girls in pink collars and cute shirts, and those who have their pits in spiked or studded thick collars. And you know what...if the pitbulls are happy, treated well, and loved, then they could wear upside-down crosses around their necks for all I care, really. I feel that when a person has a misconception about that "vicious pitbull" down the block, as long as that dog is a pit, the other aspects of appearance (collars, etc) really don't change things one way or another. We have posted photos of our Bully Cupcake shirts on Facebook, and it never fails...someone will HAVE to comment, "I don't like pits" or, "Why are you supporting pits, of all breeds??" And again, I do have to go back to the judging a book by it's cover thing....I just am really against it because that happens to be the battle pits face on a regular basis...the battle all of us pitbull activists have to defend all the time as well. I am also friends with a guy who had a HUGE pit with cut ears, a HUGE THICK ALL-SPIKED harness, and the guy himself looks like someone you would cross the street when you see. Well, not only is the guy a big mushy sweetheart, but his dog is like a little lamb who thinks he's a lap dog (my friend always laughs because his pit always wants to jump up and kiss me and he's afraid he's going to knock me down or get his dew claws stuck in me!). |
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Post by pitbullpassion on Dec 3, 2010 21:56:02 GMT -5
Flaming DDB? I know what forum you are talking about now!  |
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Post by catstina on Dec 3, 2010 23:13:32 GMT -5
seems to really be judging a book by its cover...and that is EXACTLY what I see happening with pitbulls each and every day, and what we are so strongly trying to fight against. am NOT the one judging here. The people who are negatively judging Pit Bulls are. They will look at the shirts and see one more way to judge a book by it's cover. I just think that too many people think that only tough guys have pit bulls and seeing skulls associated with these dogs may further these stereotypes in their minds. That is all I'm saying here. I NEVER said that I have anything against bikers helping pit bulls. They are great. They are reaching out to a whole new demographic. They are saving dogs and changing minds. I don't judge people by their appearance, but most of the people who are against pit bulls do!! I am also friends with a guy who had a HUGE pit with cut ears, a HUGE THICK ALL-SPIKED harness, and the guy himself looks like someone you would cross the street when you see. Well, not only is the guy a big mushy sweetheart, but his dog is like a little lamb who thinks he's a lap dog (my friend always laughs because his pit always wants to jump up and kiss me and he's afraid he's going to knock me down or get his dew claws stuck in me!). If the dog is so mushy and sweet, why wouldn't he want to promote that image for the breed rather than instilling further fear in people by dressing the dog in spikes? Everyone has their opinions, I just don't think it is helping the image of this breed to dress a pit in a fear inducing spiked collar. And I think a lot of people on this board would agree with my distaste for spiked collars. Now, if I saw a guy with a skull Pit shirt who had his dog on a chain with a spiked collar, I'd not appreciate it. |
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Post by RealPitBull on Dec 4, 2010 1:12:52 GMT -5
I'm not a fan of those bully spiked collars (they seem dangerous to me!!!) but I do get where Sharon is coming from, and I like the notion of "not judging a book by its cover". I guess because I sort of fall into several categories that tend to get judged so I can be a little overly sympathetic to the "underdog/outcast" types. Obviously I own Pit Bulls, and that in and of itself leaves one open for judgment. How many times have I had to listen to/read, "Only white trash illiterate *ssholes own those things!" I also have tattoos, which brings another stigma to the table. People with tattoos get all sorts of judgments laid upon them.
I also do *not* think that we *shouldn't* do things that are considered to "look bad", when in actuality they are harmless and functional. I know a lot of people refuse to use head collars on their dogs because they say, "That looks like a muzzle and I don't want people to think I have to muzzle my Pit Bull!" While I 100% GET that mindset, I also say, if a head collar benefits your dog in some way, why not use it as an avenue to educate. People who say head collars look bad may also be quick to slap a huge prong collar on their dog. IMO, a huge prong collar looks worse (not to even mention the humane implications). If someone's lifestyle, image, whatever, tends to be of the stereotyped minority, and that person happens to have Pit Bulls, and the two images (Pit Bull + stereotyped minority) merge, I think it opens up a unique opportunity to educate. Yes I have Pit Bulls, yes I have tattoos, and I'm actually a fine, upstanding citizen who works hard, doesn't break the law (ok, except for speeding. I speed! THERE! I said it!), and am super-committed to being a good dog mom + showing Pit Bulls in a good light.
To me, there is a difference between what I am talking about above, and someone who seems to go out of their way to show off their Pit Bull in such a way that makes the dog look extra tough or just generally badly rep the breed (even if they are, say, taking good care of their dogs) - like walking around in 6-inch spiked collars that are 2 inches wide, on a heavy chain leash. What purpose does that serve other than to make a statement: my dog is bad ass, and can kick your ass along with your dog's! If that is just the "style" you are imposing on your dog, ok, but just realize you aren't exactly doing your dog justice by dressing him up like that and you are being insensitive to the plight of these dogs.
Still, the worst and most inexcusable thing has nothing to do with outward appearances, and everything to do with portraying the dogs as inwardly "bad" or aggressive, and what I'm talking about is images that show the breed behaving aggressively and/or actually encourage/doing nothing about aggressive behavior in your dog in general, not keeping your dog properly confined/on leash, and not training your dog.
I know I'm being convoluted, but I'm very against judging JUST on looks or "style" or whatever and I don't think this topic in general is just a black or white issue. I feel like as long as you are doing things WITH and TO your dog that are appropriate, considerate of the dog and the breed's reputation, never harmful, and you aren't using your dog to scare people (either through his behavior or through dressing him up in a scary way that is 100% nonfunctional), I'm ok with it.
And FWIW, I have seen some Pit Bull tee shirts in REALLY poor taste. The PitBullShirt.com tee's have a specific style to them, but IMO it is obvious they are meant to promote the breed in a fun, interesting way. There are no images of the breed depicted in anything but a lighthearted, cute, approachable way.
In contrast, I had an MMA clothing company approach me to do a link swap - I said no because the company used "game" in their name and their logo was a lunging Pit Bull. It was innocent, they were just an MMA clothing company promoting the idea that fighters who used their gear were tough and scrappy and would never back down. Still, I felt that the way the breed was presented was incorrect. If they had had a name that didn't use a term that is associated with DOG fighting and a logo that did not show the breed in an aggressive stance, I would have been 100% fine with it (even though fighters are another group of people that carry a stigma).
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Post by catstina on Dec 4, 2010 11:45:52 GMT -5
Mary, I just want to start by saying you are always so eloquent and intelligent with your posts. The way you worded your response really made me understand your point. It makes sense. I agree that, "we *shouldn't* do things that are considered to "look bad", when in actuality they are harmless and functional."
I had a gentle leader on Benny because it helped with his pulling. Once a young boy asked, "Is your dog friendly? Can I pet him?" I told him that Benny was friendly and then the boy asked, "Then why do you have a muzzle on him?" I used it as a chance to educate the boy on gentle leaders and how they aren't the same as muzzles. Did I stop using the gentle leader because of this situation? No. I thought it was benefiting Benny and helping him learn not to pull, so I kept using it. My step father takes every chance he gets to take a dig at me about the breed, I was once yelled at by a woman on the street when walking Benny for owning "such a dangerous dog in a highly populated area," I was called "trailer-trash with a pitbull" on an other forum once for simply stating that I was against BSL. So I know all about the stigma that can be attached to the owners/lovers/advocates of pit bulls. You really need to grow a thick skin to deal with it.
I agree that we should not stop doing things that we normally do just to serve others' views. I guess someone who normally wears skulls and things of that sort, should not change their own apparel when they're walking their dog just to make the dog seem friendlier. It won't really change a person's mind about the dog if you are dressed in a polo shirt and khakis while walking a dog that they fear. What you wear when you are with your dog won't really change opinions much, but wearing an image some may find intimidating on a shirt that says "Pit Bull" right on it (even if you are no where near your pit) can make people associate that image with pits.
I guess all I was trying to say is that I wouldn't like wearing a shirt that associates pit bulls with a symbol of death. I just don't think it's the best way to make the breed less feared. I was certainly not trying to attack anyone's personal sense of style (if I wasn't phobic of needles I would have tattoos, too, I think they are an amazingly creative form of self expression) and I was not attacking PitBullShirt.com. I was simply stating my opinion based on my experience with people that don't like pit bulls.
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Post by RealPitBull on Dec 7, 2010 8:58:37 GMT -5
Thanks, Christina. I'm glad my post made sense. I understand your position, as well! |
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