|
|
Post by RealPitBull on Jan 25, 2011 10:29:37 GMT -5
Just a friendly reminder - know your facts before you attempt to educate others! ;D I've been seeing some REALLY incorrect information about the breed being passed off as fact lately (not on this forum, because our members here are awesome and educated!  ). If we are to defend the breed, we need to come across as intelligent and knowledgeable. Statements like "Pit Bulls were originally bred to herd cattle and pull things" are ignorant at best. Know your breed history! /mini-rant  |
|
|
|
Post by tjamison2001 on Jan 25, 2011 15:16:22 GMT -5
The only thing my dog "herds" is the gecko lizzards in the yard.....
|
|
|
|
Post by sugar on Jan 25, 2011 15:29:41 GMT -5
Chubby was bred to be a show-quality napper and champion counter surfer. lol
But seriously, its odd because one side says "they were originally bred to kill anything and everything" the other side says "they were bred to help farmers, babysit kids and such". Its like one side only sees bad and one side only tries to see good but ultimately they get it both wrong.
|
|
|
|
Post by RealPitBull on Jan 25, 2011 15:41:28 GMT -5
It's pretty much non-debateable that the breed's original purpose was as a pit fighting dog.
|
|
|
|
Post by Dave on Jan 25, 2011 15:59:39 GMT -5
So Mary, where you been hangin' out lately? |
|
|
|
Post by pittilove29 on Jan 25, 2011 16:39:55 GMT -5
|
|
|
|
Post by catstina on Jan 25, 2011 18:00:28 GMT -5
I love your well written, legible responses to your friend's garbled mess about "American Bull Terriers!" I hate it SOOO much when people try to change the name of our breed! If you don't like the name American PIT Bull Terrier, then get a different breed or call your dog an AmStaff. Also I think that when people do those, "Pick out the Pit Bull" games they should use a Pit Bull that conforms to the breed standard rather than a hideous BYB dog.
|
|
|
|
Post by pittilove29 on Jan 25, 2011 18:31:02 GMT -5
Yeah. My friend that created the note did not choose good examples of any of the breeds. There are less scary Am. Bullies out there. That was also pointed out in the comments.
|
|
|
|
Post by Dave on Jan 25, 2011 18:40:14 GMT -5
I debated with myself to post this, because I have been flamed in the past for what I know and have learned. But...
That picture of the actual pit bull is not a poorly bred or BYB dog. It is a Tom Garner dog, with a respected pedigree in those circles, and is considered one of his best prospective studs. Garner doesn't breed for conformation, he breeds what works for him, and what worked for others in the dogs' past. Form follows function, and is the main reason APBTs look the way they do.
I'm not glorifying, I'm just sayin'.
|
|
|
|
Post by catstina on Jan 25, 2011 18:40:57 GMT -5
I noticed and I think you (and other commenters) did a great job at pointing it out, I just wanted to say it too!
|
|
|
|
Post by pittilove29 on Jan 25, 2011 18:49:05 GMT -5
I debated with myself to post this, because I have been flamed in the past for what I know and have learned. But... That picture of the actual pit bull is not a poorly bred or BYB dog. It is a Tom Garner dog, with a respected pedigree in those circles, and is considered one of his best prospective studs. Garner doesn't breed for conformation, he breeds what works for him, and what worked for others in the dogs' past. Form follows function, and is the main reason APBTs look the way they do. I'm not glorifying, I'm just sayin'. I've heard about his dogs, watched his youtube videos, and really like a lot of his dogs (he has way too many), but the dog in that picture does not look like it could be a working dog without getting injured. The feet look splayed, and the front legs/chest almost look deformed. What is considered somebody's best prospective studs is somebody else's monster. |
|
|
|
Post by catstina on Jan 25, 2011 18:52:09 GMT -5
Dave, that's very interesting, I genuinely thought that he was a BYB. I hope you don't take offense, but to me, the dog looks terrible. His feet look off kilter, he's bow legged, barrel chested, and he looks all around unhealthy. Plus, the size of that chain is nauseating. Perhaps it's a good example of a Tom Garner dog, but that dog is not a good example of the American Pit Bull Terrier standard! You say form follows function, what does he breed his dogs to do?
To me, if you are intentionally breeding away from the standard you may as well be a BYB!! That is just my opinion, what do others think?
|
|
|
|
Post by Dave on Jan 25, 2011 18:58:52 GMT -5
Garner breeds sporting dogs, not pets. I think you know what that means. Pulling, hog catching or whatever you think a sporting pit bull has the ability to do.
There may be reasons his legs are in the condition they are in. Injuries can make mutants. He may not have been born that way. It's also an unflattering angle.
The reason they use those chains and triple thick leather and web collars is for security. When you have DA dogs together like that the last thing you want is an escapee. Remember what happened at Best Friends with the two Vick dogs that escaped?
They all have too many dogs IMO. They cull alot, too. They are all basically puppy mills, they just don't sell every dog.
|
|
|
|
Post by pittilove29 on Jan 25, 2011 18:59:26 GMT -5
I personally love the ADBA's standard for APBTs and don't see why people would want to breed away from standard. I find that dog very unattractive and think it's an injury waiting to happen if he does actually work his dogs. With the overpopulation problem we're having I think breeders need to stop experimenting to create something new and different. Especially if that dog is the outcome.
|
|
|
|
Post by adoptapitbull on Jan 25, 2011 19:05:17 GMT -5
The Pit in that photo does look pretty strange to me, too. Maybe it's just a bad photo...
I was about to guess that none of the dogs were Pits because I knew B and C weren't, but A looked so weird.
|
|
|
|
Post by RealPitBull on Jan 25, 2011 19:05:44 GMT -5
A lot of gamebred Pit Bulls have that wide chest and slightly bowed front. I don't know if it is a side effect from the chains they are kept on or not, but I would imagine partly. Sedona has almost the same front as the dog in the picture.
|
|
|
|
Post by RealPitBull on Jan 25, 2011 19:09:01 GMT -5
It's pretty much non-debateable that the breed's original purpose was as a pit fighting dog. LOL Nobody ;D |
|
|
|
Post by Dave on Jan 25, 2011 19:09:08 GMT -5
Well, game dog breeders could give a rats ass what their dogs look like. But, the standaard for an ADBA pit bull is meant for conformation competion, the reasoning being this conformation is what a healthy pit bull should look like for the best performance. That's not always the case. It's like putting the cart before the horse. Just because a dog looks a certain way doesn't mean it works. heck, look at the mess Americans made of the German Shepherd. European example can far outperform ours.
Comformation standards came about because of outlawing dogfighting. If you look at other pictures of Garner's dogs many of them look like the standard.
|
|
|
|
Post by catstina on Jan 25, 2011 19:14:57 GMT -5
If you look at other pictures of Garner's dogs many of them look like the standard. Well, that dog doesn't and you said that dog is one of his "best" prospective studs. From what I've heard I don't like this breeder and consider him a BYB. I also don't think he deserves anyone's respect if he is breeding his dogs for fighting. I know that is the history of Pit Bulls, but it is HISTORY for a reason. |
|
|
|
Post by emilys on Jan 25, 2011 20:20:00 GMT -5
can't read the note. American bull terrier WAS a name that some of the fanciers trying to get AKC recognition wanted to use. But the existing Bull Terrier group would not allow it (ironic, since known APBTs were shown as BTs in the conformation ring before 1936). And American bull terrier is the name underneath the white prick eared (or cropped) dog used to represent the USA in those WW1 posters. But of course there has NEVER been a breed of that name in any of the legitimate registries. |
|
). If we are to defend the breed, we need to come across as intelligent and knowledgeable. Statements like "Pit Bulls were originally bred to herd cattle and pull things" are ignorant at best. 
I look forward to learning much here