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Post by RealPitBull on Dec 9, 2008 11:37:58 GMT -5
I agree with the sentiment, here.... www.peta. org/mc/NewsItem. asp?id=12303 PETA Urges AKC to Take Action to Stop Tail-Docking, Ear-Cropping, Genetic Defects For Immediate Release: December 4, 2008 Contact: Lindsay Rajt 757-622-7382 Raleigh, N.C. -- In the wake of the American Veterinary Medical Association' s recent announcement that it condemns cropping the ears and docking the tails of dogs as breed standards, PETA has sent an urgent letter to American Kennel Club (AKC) President and CEO Dennis Sprung urging him to ban these painful mutilations. PETA is also calling on the AKC to alter breed standards in order to discourage breeding dogs for traits that cause debilitating health problems (such as long ears which are prone to infection) and genetic defects that can result in painful skin conditions, bone problems, and heart failure, among many other problems. In its letter, PETA points out that the AKC's British counterpart, The Kennel Club, is currently examining and revising standards for 209 breeds and has already changed the breed standard for Pekingese dogs, whose flat faces often cause breathing problems and make the animals prone to overheating. "Breed standards that encourage dogs' ears and tails to be chopped off have already caused enough suffering," says PETA Vice President Daphna Nachminovitch. "When breeders attempt to create exact replicas within breeds, they help perpetuate inherited diseases that doom dogs to a lifetime of suffering and their guardians to an avalanche of vet bills." For more information and to view the letter, please visit PETA's blog.
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Post by emilys on Dec 9, 2008 14:35:51 GMT -5
yeah, well when PETA stops slaughtering dogs, maybe I'll care what they say about anything
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Post by Courtney on Dec 9, 2008 15:06:27 GMT -5
^ That doesn't make any sense
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Post by RealPitBull on Dec 9, 2008 15:25:36 GMT -5
yeah, well when PETA stops slaughtering dogs, maybe I'll care what they say about anything Well....in MY mind..... ...it doesn't matter if PETA is saying it or someone else, because the argument is still valid. The point is that many standards and judging practices encourage gross deformities in dogs. And try as I might, I just cannot justify tail docking and cropping to maintain type. Other than that, I share your utter detestation of PETA.
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Post by RealPitBull on Dec 9, 2008 15:29:05 GMT -5
I wish we had some 'middle road', non-hypotcritcal organization that would speak for dogs on some of these subjects. Because this is the problem...lots of people dismiss and don't think about a topic because 'PETA said it'.
BTW, I am not condemning any one who crops or docks. I don't think people who crop or dock are bad people. Not by a long shot. I just wish more people would stop-think-listen. I read some posts on various boards and lists and when the subject of ear or crop bans pops up, people freak out just as much as they do when talking about breed bans. I don't think an ear or crop ban in this country would mean the demise of the purebred dog. I just don't.
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Post by Courtney on Dec 9, 2008 15:42:34 GMT -5
Is there some benefit of cropping/docking that I'm not aware of? I don't understand why people cling to it so much...
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Post by RealPitBull on Dec 9, 2008 15:46:55 GMT -5
Is there some benefit of cropping/docking that I'm not aware of? I don't understand why people cling to it so much... No, you aren't missing anything. It is tradition, and people are loathe to change.
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Post by RealPitBull on Dec 9, 2008 15:48:51 GMT -5
For some herding/working dogs, a tail could hypothetically get in the way, but I'm still not buying it. There are more breeds with tails than without and I think dogs should die with all the extremities they were born with.
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Post by Courtney on Dec 9, 2008 15:50:19 GMT -5
Agreed
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Post by coolhandjean on Dec 9, 2008 16:22:23 GMT -5
The crazy thing is some standards say they prefer the natural ears, and people still get them cropped, and they seem to place better.
Just wanted to add PETA can go eat an egg.
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Post by emilys on Dec 9, 2008 18:46:17 GMT -5
... Just wanted to add PETA can go eat an egg. or lots and lots of apple seeds! LOTS and lots of apple seeds :funnyface:
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angels8
I Love RPBF!
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Posts: 252
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Post by angels8 on Dec 9, 2008 20:36:43 GMT -5
*feeds an apple core to PETA* No but really now, PETA jumped all over Britney Spear's Circus video for the tigers and elephants in it and now this? Man they have been busy lately. I complete agree with the docking/cropping being useless, but what they are trying to get pushed through is the slow and inevitable removal of breeds as pets. Long ears, Like a basset. These dogs are meant to have extremely long ears and an side effect to those long ears are constant ear infections. OK, So now the basset breed has shorter ears, and other breeds are starting to loose their defining traits. I bet P**A will say they are too low, too heavy, too domesticated. Soon we are back with wild wolf dog exactly where P**A wants pets Gone and no longer domesticated.
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Post by RealPitBull on Dec 10, 2008 8:42:06 GMT -5
*feeds an apple core to PETA* No but really now, PETA jumped all over Britney Spear's Circus video for the tigers and elephants in it and now this? Man they have been busy lately. I complete agree with the docking/cropping being useless, but what they are trying to get pushed through is the slow and inevitable removal of breeds as pets. Long ears, Like a basset. These dogs are meant to have extremely long ears and an side effect to those long ears are constant ear infections. OK, So now the basset breed has shorter ears, and other breeds are starting to loose their defining traits. I bet P**A will say they are too low, too heavy, too domesticated. Soon we are back with wild wolf dog exactly where P**A wants pets Gone and no longer domesticated. Well look, PETA is a whacko, extremist org and we all know this, and hopefully no one on this forum supports them. I posted the above info for two reasons: 1) because it's news; and 2) to bring light to a subject that doesn't necessarily have anything to do with PETA. For the sake of the rest of this discussion, let's try to separate PETA from the issues of cropping/docking and extremely overdone traits in breeds. What you see in purebred dogs in this day in age isn't what you'd have seen in the same breeds when they first were established. Really, compare AmStaffs in the ring today, with AmStaffs when they first were accepted into the AKC (and AmStaffs really, compared to some other breeds, haven't changed much at all comparitively speaking). Also consider just about any other breed you want. Some breeds aren't even recognizable as the same when you compare early pix with new. There is NO DOUBT that dogs bred for looks over function suffer for it. Do you think the average Basset hound in the show ring today does any real work? Having said that, I DEFINITELY understand where you are coming from, and PETA, yes, does want to see breeds eradicated - well, pets in general eradicated. In their minds, the actions they are pushing AKC to engage in probably are just a step towards that direction. But I'm not of the PETA mindset, I do not support PETA. I do support the IDEA of making things better in the world of pureberd dogs. I would support some amendments to breed standards and re-education of judges. I am a HUGE dog show fan, btw, and I have shown in the past (and will certainly show dogs in the future), so believe me, I have NO intentions of supporting ANYthing that would cause the demise of dog shows or the purebred dog fancy. I would support actions that would overall make life better for dogs. It's interesting to talk about these subjects, and I appreciate everyone's polite input, regardless of where you stand
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Post by coolhandjean on Dec 10, 2008 11:31:11 GMT -5
Yeah, the show world has destroyed many breeds.
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Post by valliesong on Dec 10, 2008 14:48:13 GMT -5
I'm with you, Mary. Most of my favorite breeds are still bred for performance in many cases - beagles, pit bulls, GSDs, Rottweilers.
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angels8
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Posts: 252
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Post by angels8 on Dec 10, 2008 14:54:25 GMT -5
Is there no one hanging around that is a 3rd party source that can push the no crop no dock movement? Vets maybe? A group who is not radicals? I completely agree with the C/D procedures being unnecessary and painful and they really need to be stopped. How about some more floppy eared pibbles in the ring?
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Post by RealPitBull on Dec 10, 2008 15:01:38 GMT -5
Is there no one hanging around that is a 3rd party source that can push the no crop no dock movement? Vets maybe? A group who is not radicals? I completely agree with the C/D procedures being unnecessary and painful and they really need to be stopped. How about some more floppy eared pibbles in the ring? I'm not sure about UKC, there is a significant number of cropped dogs, but not sure about the cropped:uncropped ratio. The UKC standard also doesn't state a preference for one style over the other. The AKC standard for AmStaffs clearly states natural preferred - but cropped dogs have taken hold. I really respect people who show natural dogs to the judges. There is actually a kennel here in NJ called Preferred Natural, and she doesn't crop any of her dogs. As far as who else could lead a fight to end cropping/docking, I think the best thing that could happen would be for vets to stop offering the service. The AVMA has now taken a stand against the proceedures so hopefully we'll see a further decline in vets who crop. It is already difficult to find a vet to do a good show crop on an APBT/AST.
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Post by bubsy on Dec 10, 2008 21:14:55 GMT -5
There is NO DOUBT that dogs bred for looks over function suffer for it. Do you think the average Basset hound in the show ring today does any real work? LOL nope...but they're cute I foster for a Basset Hound rescue, and most of the dogs we get in are not show type. They are leggier, leaner, less wrinkles..and agile! I had one foster who would jump baby gates...and most of them were really athletic. They still look like Bassets, but they're less exaggerated. They'll still have problems relating to their osteochondrodysplasia however...I'm not familiar with show bred Bassets, so I'm not sure if they truly have more problems than the more moderate Bassets we get in rescue. People still hunt with Bassets here in the Deep South..though not as popular as Beagles. I'm sure we get some field type Bassets, and some plain ole BYB ones. As far as their ears...you can't take my long eared Bassets away from me LOL! I haven't had any nasty ear infections in my fosters...they need more maintenance than the average dog, that's for sure. I'll post some pics of my leggy Bassets ;D
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Post by bubsy on Dec 10, 2008 21:18:29 GMT -5
Here's Higgins, the first Basset I fostered...he could clear a baby gate with no effort LOL
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Post by coolhandjean on Dec 11, 2008 18:35:13 GMT -5
Most ADBA/AADR APBT do have natural ears.
I personally don't want to crop my APBT's ears, but I don't think it should be outlawed.
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