Petsmart discriminates on bully types

[mcgregor]

-----
please crosspost!


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Cross post this one far and wide!
If you don't agree with their breed ban, let them know by sending an email, and don't shop there anymore. I know I will.



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PETSMART BANS BULLY BREEDS FROM PET HOTELS AND DOGGIE DAY CAMP
Date: Thu, 10 Apr 2008 15:40:31 +0000


PetSmart bans "bully breeds" from PetsHotel

Here is some additional contact information. To me, this is very
worrisome. It is just a step away from banning the listed breeds and
others from visiting the store and participating in training events.

~~~~~~~~~~~~<WBR>~~~~~~~~~<WBR>~~
1. E-mail: CustomerCare@<WBR>petsmart.<WBR>com (at petsmart.<WBR>com)


2. Regular Mail:
PetSmart, Inc.
Attn: Customer Service
1435 International Drive
Eau Claire, WI 54701


3. Phone:
Toll-free: 1-888-839-9638 (U.S. Customers)
1-321-309-9065 (Customers Outside of the U.S.)
24 hours a day/7 days a week

This is from PetSmart's website, they are now banning "bully breeds" from their PetsHotel program, t his includes their Doggy Day Care. They are not basing this on individual pets, but are
discriminating.<WBR>.. Read On:

Requirements

Who may attend?

Dogs at least five months of age
Dogs who have been socialized with other dogs, but are not of the "bully breed" classification or wolves/
wolf hybrids.

Dogs who are in good health (no fleas, ticks, or contagious illnesses) No intact (unneutered) male dogs, pregnant females or females in heat Dogs who have the following vaccinations: Bordetella, Rabies, Distemper, Parainfluenza and Parvovirus

Dogs in the "bully breed" classification (e.g. American Pit Bull Terriers, Miniature Bull Terriers, American Staffordshire Terriers, Staffordshire Bull Terriers, American Bull Dogs, Bull Terriers or mixed breeds that have the appearance or characteristics of one of these breeds). For the safety of all animals and associates, and at the discretion of PetSmart, some pets may not be permitted.


The address to this page is as follows:


The only contact information I could get from the website was the number to PetSmart.com Customer Care. They should be able to either take your complaint or direct you to who can. I haven't called yet, but I am planning on it!! [phone] PetSmart.com Customer Care.

This is just another way for them to push out certain breeds, if they ban several they should ban all after all they all have fourty two teeth.

Here is some additional contact information. To me, this is very
worrisome. It is just a step away from banning the listed breeds and others from visiting the store and participating in training events.

~~~~~~~~~~~~<WBR>~~~~~~~~~<WBR>~~

1. E-mail: CustomerCare@<WBR>petsmart.<WBR>com

2. Regular Mail:
PetSmart, Inc.
Attn: Customer Service
1435 International Drive
Eau Claire, WI 54701


3. Phone:
Toll-free: 1-888-839-9638 (U.S. Customers)
1-321-309-9065 (Customers Outside of the U.S.)
24 hours a day/7 days a week



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THIS IS MY RESPONSE TO THOSE IDIOTS!


It has recently come to my attention that PetSmart is discriminating against dogs of the bully breed. The reference below has been taken from Petsmart documentation regarding their PetSmart Hotel/Doggie Day Care:

Requirements

Who may attend?

Dogs at least five months of age
Dogs who have been socialized with other dogs, but are not of the "bully breed" classification or wolves/
wolf hybrids.

My husband and I, are senior citizens and we have 10 dogs of bully heritage, all rescued, spayed and neutered. Most came to us from shelters or were rescued off the streets.

To blatently exclude a dog because of what it looks like, is discrimination, pure an simple. This is the 21st century, people; discrimination is against the law!

Yes, we have 10 dogs, to feed, to buy treats for, to buy toys for, and many of them require special supplements, which, up until this point in time, we were buying from PetSmart. I have many contacts and friends who own dogs, and who feel the same way I do; you judge an individual (whether an animal or human) on their individual characteristics; you don't judge them on what or who they look like.

I will be emailing everyone I know to let them know about your unfair discriminatory policy. Neither me, or any of my friends will be buying anything further from PetSmart. You can take that to the bank. Betty Strauss - proud owner/guardian of 10 Pit Bulls.

[RealPitBull]

Let's remember, however, that it isn't recommended for Pit Bulls to be loose in dog parks, day care centers, etc, ANYway. I'm not sure it would be a good idea for a place like PetsMart, which often employs people with limited or no prior experience/dog knowledge, to be supervising Pit Bulls in playgroups with other dogs.

Wolf Hybrids are illegal in many places (rightly so, IMO - breeding of wild animals crossed with domesticated animals is NOT something I agree with). I cannot argue with that policy, at all.

I am not sure if there is a better way PetsMart can go about handling this situation - with the climate of BSL, a large corporation declaring the breed "banned" from their daycares may not be wise. However, I personally would never recommend anyone bring their Pit Bull to such a place, and would find it extremely naive for a company that routinely places groups of dogs in pens together to include Pit Bulls in the mix. (Frankly, unless the company was run by extremely knowledgeable dog people in general, I'd never trust my dog - Pit Bull or not - to playgroups that a) were not supervised by ME, and b) included unknown dogs.

[Amanda Joy]

I actually got this message in a Myspace Post this morning. As soon as I saw this I called the customer care line. After approximately 15 minutes holding for this "customer care specialist" to find someone that could take my complaint... they took my name, my number, about 2 words of my complaint and said that someone would contact me to discuss my complaint. This all happened about 5 hours ago.
While waiting for my returned call my blood started to boil. We take Shotzi to PetSmart to have her special time. I can gurantee that will not happen anymore. I have canceled my Perks Card and my PetsMart Visa card! I know I am only one person with one dog but I will not stop telling everyone that I know to shop elsewhere.
As soon as this mystery Customer Service Rep returns my phone call I WILL get contact information to pass on to everyone so that we can atleast try to make a dent in this issue.
Oh yeah... the last time I took my babies to PetSmart Shotzi was cornered by a 10 lb Jack Russell that tried as hard as he could to rip Shotzi's leg off and the only response from the people that worked there was a little giggle at how cute the little dog was. If bullies are being banned because they are "attack dogs" then lets look at every newspaper article that can be found and get EVERY SINGLE breed that has EVER attacked someone banned from public!

[mcgregor]

mary ......
the ban suggests the wrong message sent out... we as responsible pitbull owners know it is not proper to bring our dogs to dogparks or doggie daycare etc but that should be our choice even though its not what we would actually do.....Petsmart is siding with all the ignorance that is made out over pitbulls and other so called dangerous breeds........

[RealPitBull]

Apr 16, 2008 17:47:56 GMT -5 mcgregor said:

mary ......
the ban suggests the wrong message sent out... we as responsible pitbull owners know it is not proper to bring our dogs to dogparks or doggie daycare etc but that should be our choice even though its not what we would actually do.....Petsmart is siding with all the ignorance that is made out over pitbulls and other so called dangerous breeds........

So you believe that PetsMart should allow any/all dogs into the day care? What about ignorant owners who misrepresent their Pit Bulls? Can PetsMart employees be trusted to properly evaluate the dogs coming through their doors? It sounds very much from what I've read that the onus is on the owner to represent their dogs as dog-friendly.

I agree - as I stated above - that how they are handling this issue may not be the best bet. BUT, how else can they handle it? Perhaps we can brainstorm and help PetsMart be responsible about the breed, in a way that may seem less discriminatory. I do not believe PetsMart is being 'anti Pit Bull', I believe they are just trying to keep everyone safe.

Let's face it, not all breeds belong in all situations.

[RealPitBull]

I want to remind everyone, too, that it does NOT HELP our cause to become irate, unreasonable, or name-call (i.e. the above letter refers to PetsMart as "those idiots"). That sounds really unprofessional and counter-productive. PetsMart is, in effect, taking the advice of countless pro-Pit Bull websites that state Pit Bulls do not do well loose with other dogs.

Perhaps this is a good opportunity to brainstorm a bit and get the message across that our breed needs special management considerations, but doso in a way that does not feed into a BSL mentality.

[Amanda Joy]

So my thought is that if someone is raising their bullies in a responsible way, then they have a vet that knows the dog and is familiar with the dog and its behavior. I think we should be able to bring a recomendation or "approval" letter from our vet letting the employees know that the dog is safe. People that are raising super aggressive dogs or are fighting their bullies wouldnt take that dog to see a qualified vet. I am aware that obtaining this letter would create an extra step in the whole process.... BUT.... we all knew that we weren't going to be raising the next Lassie in the eyes of the public.
I personally won't use a pet hotel simply because I fear that someone that isnt as familiar with Shtozi would unknowingly do something that would result in an injury. BUT for those owners that want to use the PetSmart hotel, it seems to me that prior vet approval or something along that line would satisfy the safety of the employees and desire of owners to not be discriminated against.

P.S. I really hope that makes sense to everyone, I am an emotional typist and sometimes it just all comes out jumbled... who would have thought I have a minor in English... LOL!

[RealPitBull]

Yes Amanda, that makes very good sense!! I think you are on the right track, some kind of vouching from a professional/official screening - and perhaps this can be done for ALL dogs that enter the daycare, etc. May I suggest that a behaviorist/certified trainer as opposed to a vet, be the one to write the letter? Vets do NOT get trained in behavior, and oftentimes are just as clueless as dog owners about behavior/training.

The problem is that a) not everyone is educated enough to make proper evaluations of breed and temperament. For me, I'd venture to say 99.9% of Pit Bulls, as a trainer, I'd recommend NOT be taken to a place where dogs will be loose together - supervised or not. I also would generally have that suggestion for ALL dog breed owners, unless I knew that the service center was run by truly competent, educated staff. Make sense? In a way, all dogs AND the day care centers need to be properly evaluated before the two come together.

B) How reasonable is it to assume that a business like PetsMart would be willing/able to turn away everyone from daycare/boarding if the dog hadn't been prior evaluated by a professional? I think lots of folks would simply go elsewhere.

What we've got right now is -

1) A recognition that responsible Pit Bull owners know their dogs and most likely would not subject their dogs to a dog park/daycare/playgroup scenario, because for most Pit Bulls, such a situation is a Set Up For Failure. However, lots of naive/uneducated people may attempt to bring their dogs inappropriately to such places and in effect, companies have to have some kind of safety precautions in place to address this problem.

2) No Pit Bull owner wants to see Pit Bulls BANNED from anywhere, and the message PetsMart is sending may fuel BSL efforts.

3) Some sort of screening process that is NOT breed specific is an excellent idea for companies like PetsMart. And I think NO responsible company can get away with NOT screening, at least in some preliminary way. PetsMart is obviously screening, but singling out a specific breed that is already under fire and being banned in a variety of ways and in a variety of places.

[RealPitBull]

I'd also like to know what sort of screening process does PetsMart have in place for all OTHER breeds? They only take the word of the owner that the dog was 'socialized'? HARDLY safe! As we all know, ALL dogs can fight, and a fight with any breed can be damaging. So companies need to be able to properly screen ALL breeds/dogs coming through their doors. PesMart has banned Pit Bulls, but how do they secure the safety of the dogs that DO enter into their daycare?

[RealPitBull]

One more thought! Isn't it expected that a company like PetsMart offering dog services to the public be professional and educated, and choose policies that make sense based on education and what is best for all invovled?

For instance, if an owner came to me and asked for advice about bringing their Pit Bull to a dog park, and I told them NO, your dog is a Pit Bull, and that my 'policy' is that I tell ALL Pit Bull owners NOT to bring their dogs to dog parks, does that make ME 'anti Pit Bull', or discriminatory?

When we are hiring a dog professional to provide services to us/our dog, don't we expect that professional to guide us to the best course of action for all involved?

Just another way to look at this situation.

[bullymommy25]

Okay, I think some action needs to be taken here. I was on the line with the care center, and the woman did not have any real info on why or anything other than "Bully Breeds are not allowed". I explained to her that my concern is with the image that this is projecting, and that there are MANY other breeds, especially terrier breeds, that are dog aggressive/animal aggressive; I explained that this seems to single out pit bulls and back up the pro BSL people's stance.
I MUST back Mary up on this, that ANY calls or contact with any persons need to be mature and professional. Any name calling or anger just reinforces the stereotype of the "thuggish" irresponsible pit bull owner, so please, voice your objections in a polite way.
I feel that we can have a chance to influence this action, though, because PetSmart takes my money, as well as money from possible a million other pit bull owners.
The care rep claimed they did not have a number for the corporate offices, but that it could be found on the internet, and corperate are the ones we must deal with.
Mary, I want to defer to your experience here. Is there a way that we can approach this company in an effort to protect our breed, while recognizing their concerns? Even a change in the WORDING of their policy would satisfy me. I do not use these day care programs or take my dog to dog parks either, and other than the poor image they are projecting, I don't necessarily disagree. I don't think ANY breed is safe in this sort of setting.
Please let me know. I think something should be done before this gets into some politician's head.

[RealPitBull]

This isn't really a cut and dried thing. Even something with a bit more elaboration as to why they do not allow certain breeds and/or that certain breeds need 'approval' from a qualified professional. I would be curious to know how they evaluate other breeds that come through their doors to establish that they are safe to mingle with others.

Bottom line is it's company policy - people can choose to go elsewhere, but as I said, many similar establishments have the same policy. The company up the street from me, which is day care and does not have kennel runs (they have enclosures for multiple dogs), does not allow Pit Bulls. They are actually pro-Pit Bull but recognize the limitations of the breed. They also don't have a big glaring policy on their site that says, "No Pit Bulls for the safety of our employees!!!". So...

[mcgregor]

I do believe that we as responsible owners politely advocate the pitbull cause as to separate us from the thuggish foul mouthed citizens owning pits . society as a whole frowns on these types and therby is a losing clause in the process.....

Mary
Quote your excerpt: 2)" No Pit Bull owner wants to see Pit Bulls BANNED from anywhere, and the message PetsMart is sending may fuel BSL efforts"...... This is exactly the point of the article that I posted, it seriously sends the wrong message but your explanation justifys the reality of the truth....

[RealPitBull]

Apr 18, 2008 8:49:42 GMT -5 mcgregor said:

I do believe that we as responsible owners politely advocate the pitbull cause as to separate us from the thuggish foul mouthed citizens owning pits . society as a whole frowns on these types and therby is a losing clause in the process.....

Mary
Quote your excerpt: 2)" No Pit Bull owner wants to see Pit Bulls BANNED from anywhere, and the message PetsMart is sending may fuel BSL efforts"...... This is exactly the point of the article that I posted, it seriously sends the wrong message but your explanation justifys the reality of the truth....

I'm not sure what you mean by my "explanation justifes the reality of the truth" - what explanation, and can you elaborate?

[mcgregor]

Mary ..... I worded it wrong ,sorry typo here... I meant to say that it justifies the reason of why Petsmart although pitbull supporters ; want to ban them from its stores.... your explanations do make sense....that article was written and crossposted by someone else on another pitbull group that iam a member of...

[RealPitBull]

Apr 19, 2008 9:52:16 GMT -5 mcgregor said:

Mary ..... I worded it wrong ,sorry typo here... I meant to say that it justifies the reason of why Petsmart although pitbull supporters ; want to ban them from its stores.... your explanations do make sense....that article was written and crossposted by someone else on another pitbull group that iam a member of...

Ok, thanks for explaining I did realize that you didn't write the original post and were forwarding. And I appreciate you posting it so we could discuss here.

[bullymommy25]

I would not leave my doggie with any barely trained "day camp" employee regardless... they don't know my dog, they won't care for her like I do, etc... and if some other dog jumped on her they might blame her and be mean to her or worse. I don't drop my child off at some random place for the day/week either.
But they are completely retarded for the way they made this rule "for the safety of our associates, no bully breeds or wolf hybrids" as if there is ANY similarity... and as if pits are supposed to be aggressive to humans... I will be shopping elsewhere, which stinks b/c petsmart is closest, but hey...
i think they need to rechange the wording. And I'm also hearing a LOT of shady things about petsmart, dogs running out of the grooming place and getting hit by cars, dead hamsters...
Everytime someone tries to make some rule about bully breeds and doesn't seem to have consulted any of the experts of the breed it makesmy stomach curl up

[RealPitBull]

Apr 19, 2008 17:52:34 GMT -5 bullymommy25 said:

I would not leave my doggie with any barely trained "day camp" employee regardless... they don't know my dog, they won't care for her like I do, etc... and if some other dog jumped on her they might blame her and be mean to her or worse. I don't drop my child off at some random place for the day/week either.
But they are completely retarded for the way they made this rule "for the safety of our associates, no bully breeds or wolf hybrids" as if there is ANY similarity... and as if pits are supposed to be aggressive to humans... I will be shopping elsewhere, which stinks b/c petsmart is closest, but hey...
i think they need to rechange the wording. And I'm also hearing a LOT of shady things about petsmart, dogs running out of the grooming place and getting hit by cars, dead hamsters...
Everytime someone tries to make some rule about bully breeds and doesn't seem to have consulted any of the experts of the breed it makesmy stomach curl up

I don't necessarily consider PetsMart the epitome of canine professional services, ya know?

In fairness to PetsMart, however, the "safety of our employees" statement didn't necessarily refer to JUST bull breeds - it actually says this (emphasis mine):

"Dogs in the "bully breed" classification (e.g. American Pit Bull Terriers, Miniature Bull Terriers, American Staffordshire Terriers, Staffordshire Bull Terriers, American Bull Dogs, Bull Terriers or mixed breeds that have the appearance or characteristics of one of these breeds). For the safety of all animals and associates, and at the discretion of PetSmart, some pets may not be permitted."

I think that last sentence could have been in a different paragraph, but it implies to me that certain pets in general MAY NOT be allowed into the day care, for SAFETY reasons. This could be any breed.

[AmyJo27]

I agree with MAry; I would never leave my dogs alone with each other let alone leave them with dogs they are unfamiliar with! Then again I wouldnt even let my dogs off leash around another dog that they dont know! I love APBT's and bully breeds but why give an oppertunity for something bad to happen!

[windowdog]

Personally I walked tons and tons of dogs in college, would go into peoples homes when no one was home and take their dogs out for a walk. I'm kind of amazed this list is limited to Pits. Shepherds gave me the most trouble, and let me tell you a pissed off Great Dane is just about the scariest thing on earth, imagine being chased by a carnivorous pony. I never had an issue with pits though.

I know the danger for them is more in dog on dog violence, but I'm still amazed that Petsmart doesn't have a broader (we reserve the right to refuse any dog) guideline. Really the nastiest dogs I ever met were small little things like corgis and min-pins. I think tiny dogs get away with a lot of aggression that would get a normal sized dog put down.