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Post by RealPitBull on Jul 17, 2008 8:48:02 GMT -5
This was posted on my dog trainers list - apparently he is being hailed as 'the next Cesar'. There is nothing special about what he is doing. He is training old military style, using pain and force to get the dog to do what he wants. A classic example of how NOT to train.
Go to youtube.com and type prdmre into the search box.
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snipe
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Post by snipe on Jan 21, 2009 19:50:05 GMT -5
which video?
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Post by RealPitBull on Jan 22, 2009 8:15:57 GMT -5
There are quite a few, if you type "prdmre" into the search field, it should bring his stuff up.
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Post by bamapitbullmom on Jan 22, 2009 12:25:15 GMT -5
Geez, I watched about half of how this guy "trained" RD to stay until I almost yacked. It didn't make any sense! And here's yet another person suggesting goofy methods which are prolly going get some people bitten.
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snipe
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Post by snipe on Jan 22, 2009 15:03:15 GMT -5
ya i watched the stay one. it was weird but it didn't seem cruel (i didn't watch the whole thing becuz the guy is boring) what i would have done is told the dog to sit and stay then move back. wait. then treat. repeat in longer increments. idk how holding the dog their is going to make that connection cuz it probably just thinks your petting it. my guess is the dog already knew stay and this guy was just making a video to get attention.
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Post by bamapitbullmom on Jan 22, 2009 15:40:52 GMT -5
No one said he was cruel, just goofy. Suggesting ineffective and possibly dangerous ways to train dogs is irresponsible and isn't going to help anyone. Not to mention one method doesn't work for all dogs.
I don't even teach a cue until the dog understands the behavior I am training. You have to get the behavior first, then "name" it.
This guy is doing things very backwards. And so many things are happening here...this dog is being rewarded for tons of behaviors which none of them would be acceptable for a reliable "stay".
Stay means to hold a position and not move from it. In manners and pet dog training, I prefer to teach an owner how to train a "wait" which means to not move forward, such as out of a vehicle or until released to exit a door.
I'd like to see how this guy morphs this type of training into distance. Half the time the dog didn't even notice the hand cue much less had any clue what was expected of him.
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snipe
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Post by snipe on Jan 22, 2009 15:47:37 GMT -5
ya i taught my dog wait as well. "He is training old military style, using pain and force to get the dog to do what he wants" i didn't see any with this type training, but then again i only watched two and then turned them off, in response to above post that's where i got cruel from
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Post by bamapitbullmom on Jan 22, 2009 21:47:13 GMT -5
Snipe~ It may help if you would quote posts and respond to them directly so that we know exactly what you are replying to.
Your last post confused me and I don't have time to scroll through posts to find what it is you may be referring to.
Also, I see that you are new and have been very active in posting, particularly to behavioral and training topics so I'd love for you to properly intorduce yourself to everyone in the New Member Intros threads so we know who we're talking to.
I can't speak for Mary but I would assume, since we share the same philosophies and methods in regards to training, her reference to this guy using "old military style, using pain and force to get the dog to do what he wants" is backed up by the experience of knowing forlks using physical manipulation and the strong impulse to force a dog to comply. Many times, what we see done in public is pale in comparison to what they do behind the scenes. It's a mentality thing. A misunderstanding or complete dismissal of science results in frustration and "dominant" handling.
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snipe
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Post by snipe on Jan 22, 2009 21:54:53 GMT -5
o ok idk how to quote just part of a post in quick reply so that's why i do that, not the formal quote box but i can quote the whole post if you'd like.
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Post by RealPitBull on Jan 23, 2009 8:21:29 GMT -5
Snipe.....you can quote by hitting the 'quote button instead of the reply button on the post you are responding to I haven't checked this guy's vid's out in a while, maybe he has some new ones up, or ones I didn't see that are more quirky and not so heavy handed. But the couple I saw showed him jerking a Great Dane around like crazy. He was getting a lot of hits and people were praising him as the New Cesar Millan. I thought some more informed people could post rebuttals. I'm always on the fence about things like this, though - hard to say whether more attention makes things better or worse.
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Post by RealPitBull on Jan 23, 2009 8:23:59 GMT -5
And I agree, I like for all new members to post an introduction - this is a pretty friendly, close-knit board and we all have gotten to 'know' each other through our time spent here. It's a little disconcerting to be having conversation with just a user name on a forum. All new members go through an application process before their accounts are activated but only the forum admin (moi) gets to see those, so other members aren't privy to that info. Plus it's good formum etiqutte to post an intro anyway. No worries, just in case you missed the Intro board.
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snipe
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Post by snipe on Jan 23, 2009 18:05:01 GMT -5
This was posted on my dog trainers list - apparently he is being hailed as 'the next Cesar'. There is nothing special about what he is doing. He is training old military style, using pain and force to get the dog to do what he wants. A classic example of how NOT to train. Go to youtube.com and type prdmre into the search box. This is probably where you got the "training old military style, using pain and force to get the dog to do what he wants."
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Post by bamapitbullmom on Jan 23, 2009 18:53:00 GMT -5
Can't tell if you are being sarcastic, snipe but if you were, I can do the same with Cajun and I did not train him with corrections, compulsion or physical force.
The reactions from the other people in this video are the same I get when I have Cajun in WalMart or restaraunts, etc.
My issue with people who train with a "means to an end" mentality is the effect on the dog. This video shows a dog exhibiting stress signals and if we nit pick, reacting before cues.
And to quote Koehler just is icing on the cake. Blech.
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Post by bamapitbullmom on Jan 23, 2009 18:54:18 GMT -5
Oh yes, and he incorrectly spells "heel" as "heal"...grammar people.
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snipe
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Post by snipe on Jan 23, 2009 20:51:15 GMT -5
no i wasn't, in the video he talks about mastering the dog.
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Post by bubsy on Jan 24, 2009 2:34:36 GMT -5
Ugh...I was so not impressed with the agility clip...forcing dogs who have not been taught to jump over high jumps. Oh, and is this guy training his Dane is PP for real??? Ok, I watched some more...that is worst example of "agility" training I have ever seen! OMG, lifting an older dog over a HUGE wall??? For what? Barf.
I keep coming back to add on...I'm still watching the agility clip. Who are these people at this facility?? This really is crapola training.
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Post by mcgregor on Jan 24, 2009 7:54:29 GMT -5
I agree .... this agility training is crappola and the trainers tactics can lead to broken bones for the dog .....some people are just not in tune.......
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Chloe
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Post by Chloe on Feb 25, 2009 16:56:30 GMT -5
The only video that came up with this is the one titled 4 mos with RD. This particular one showed nothing bad, just a very well behaved GD walking around off leash in a Home Depot. Can someone pls. give me another link that shows what you guys are all talking about?
Thnks!
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Post by RealPitBull on Mar 3, 2009 12:53:40 GMT -5
Sorry, I forgot to address this post. I'll have to go back and see if I can find the vid that prompted this thread.
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